How to Write Copy That Converts

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How to Write Copy That Converts

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Writing copy for your business can be a challenge. You may think “I'm not a writer”! I'm here to tell you that if you can talk, you can write copy! Today I am chatting with Kelsey Formost Founder of Magic Words Copywriting all about the 3 actionable changes you can make to your copy TODAY to immediately improve your connections and conversions.


  • Kelsey's 3 Favorite Copywriting Tricks that will help triple your profits
  • Businesses that invest in copywriting see 3x's the conversions and sales of businesses that don't
  • Copywriting DOESN'T have to be intimidating


Clarity (how to cut everything you don't need)

Conversion (where you should actually drive customers – hint: it's not your website!)

Connection (how to take the words out of your customer's mouth)


Kelsey, founder of Magic Words Copywriting, is a marketing expert who helps entrepreneurs learn to write words that sell. She's been featured in Business Insider, Glamour, Refinery29, Boss Babe & more. She’s also an experienced public speaker & educator, chosen for events like SXSW and Inbound2020, the two top marketing conferences in the country.

Kelsey's easy-to-understand copywriting courses & templates have helped take struggling businesses to six figures and beyond, but that's not really what's important. Kelsey's mission is to de-mystify the process of communicating with an online audience, helping entrepreneurs feel empowered and inspired every time they need to write or speak about their business (and also, yeah, make more money in the process).

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  • To check out Kelsey's Copy Class Click HERE


I'm super excited for our guest today. We recently connected over Instagram and she is a wealth of knowledge. And something that she teaches is a super, super hot, hot topic right now. And it is a niche that I will never be able to crack. And so this is why I don't know. I'm not a writer, I could talk all day, but I'm not a writer. Continue Reading

But it's such a niche. And so Kelsey, welcome to the show today. I'm so excited. You're here. Oh, thank you so much. And my gosh, what a funny intro because my whole thing is teaching people who say they're not a writer, how to write their own high converting copy, like you are my favorite kind of human because I think so many of us. So many of us somewhere along the line had an English teacher give us a C on an essay about The Grapes of Wrath or something and we think, oh, we're not I'm not a writer. I'm not good at writing. But if you can talk, if you know how to talk, if you can talk to somebody on the phone, you're a writer, that I love it, I
think yeah, it's just breaking it down and simplifying. That's all I'm here to teach you some magic tricks today. I love it. And so if you are looking
Like me, and I cannot write, copy. And there's different types, which we're gonna get into that today. But I want to tell you guys that when I, when I initially met Kelsey and started talking with her, I'm like, she is so smart. Like, this girl really knows her shit.
I need to learn some stuff. I even told him and I'm like, we need to fit it on the podcast quick, because I feel like everybody that is in our audience and all of our listeners, they need to hear this and especially with it being a new year, and we're all focused on or is a question more? Where should we be focusing. And for this year, I know that one of our main focuses is how to be a better copywriter, how to write better, better how to connect with people, we are all so hungry for connection right now, just with that year of 2020. And I don't know when it's ever gonna end, I don't think it will never go back to normal ever. But before we do, there is no such thing as normal anymore. I know. But before we jump in and talk about like copywriting, I would love for you to share a little bit about your backstory in your journey. How have you and what have you done to like land in your niche of like, I'm a writer, and I'm a copywriter, and I'm going to teach other people how to do this, like, what have you done to get there. I love talking about this. So one of my favorite fun facts that people are always maybe not surprised, but just they think it's fun to know is that I actually spent over a decade in the entertainment industry as an actress and a screenwriter. So I did Shakespeare with the Royal Shakespeare Company in Edinburgh, Scotland, I did Off Broadway plays in New York City, I
did a lot of television and movies in Hollywood for six or seven years, like big stuff. And I loved that career. And what I learned in that career was how to tell a story. And the incredible power of emotional connection. really understanding how to tap into emotions, allows you to more deeply and quickly connect with the person on the other side of the screen who's watching you. And it's the same thing in business. And we often I think too often we come at business from this place of Oh, it's numbers. It's proof. It's, it's analytical. But really the most successful businesses are those who come at it from a place of emotion. Because not only does emotion foster connection, but it taps into our decision making. As human beings, we are emotional decision makers, that is what informs our choices.
So back to my story. So after a decade as an actress seeing a lot of success, I'm very, very grateful for what I was able to do. It's very glamorous looking back on it. Now I have lots of fun stories. for another day.
I had one of those crying on the bathroom floor moments that I think all entrepreneurs have had where I knew that the situation that I was in was no longer personally fulfilling enough. I wasn't happy enough. I had a lot of blessings in my life to be grateful for. But I had a bunch of stuff happened and really fast succession. I was a staff writer on a project and the entire team got laid off.
The relationship that I was in, I found out that this person I thought that was the one had been cheating. And I had no idea. And so that was the floor was ripped out from under me there. And I had just signed my very first lease for my first big girl apartment. So I was financially responsible for every bill for the first time in my life. And so there was a lot. It's a lot. It was like personal business, career path, like every possible path was a crossroads. So it wasn't even a crossroads. It was like a nine lane roundabout.
Which is a terrifying place to be in the moment. But now, I understand it's the most exciting place to be because when you are at that crying on the bathroom floor, I don't know my next move place. That's when you get to be the boss and decide really take a moment to be honest with yourself and think where do I actually want to go? Which is the most beautiful thing because that is where you're going to serve other people the most. It's not just about you. It's about what gift you have to
It's so scary. And I'm not minimizing that at all. But there is a place in that moment, for positivity and for gratitude and thinking, Okay, the thing that I thought was going to be the thing is ripped away. Now I get to make the decision.
So long story short, I decided that what really made me come alive. The thing about acting and screenwriting that made me come alive was helping people tell these stories was helping people foster these emotional connections. And after a lot of research and sort of understanding different careers that were open to me, a friend of mine who's a copywriter for Marie Forleo, was telling me about her job. And it was like the cartoon light bulb went off over my head. And I was like, this is the thing this is for me, I can help women, like foster independence by creating their own businesses, help them feel heard, get them seen, rather than just releasing words into the echo chamber of the internet, like I can really help here. And as soon as I made that decision, in that discovery, it was like everything fell into place, and everything skyrocketed. And I was a freelance copywriter for female entrepreneurs for a few years, learned a ton. And one of the most interesting things that I learned was that so many of those women did still didn't feel heard because they were afraid to find their own voice. And that's why that's why I pivoted into teaching entrepreneurs how to write their own high converting copy, because I think it's such an important skill not just for your business, but for your mental health and for your sense of self to be able to sit down and immediately know, I know exactly who I am. I know exactly who I serve. I know exactly. Why. You why I'm a value to the world. That's a beautiful thing. And copywriting is just little psychological magic tricks to help people see that. I can't wait to learn the tricks.
Like what is it but that's such a great backstory, because I think people understand
where like, there's more of a purpose of like, you just didn't start to teach copywriters or women how to write like there's a whole story like an emotional story behind it. There is and I think it's important to note in what I do specifically is I'm not teaching people how to be professional copywriters. I'm teaching people who have their own businesses or who have a small team, or whatever it is, how to write words that connect with their ideal audience in a way that is simple, easy to understand, and easy to implement right away, because that's what I want to share with the world. I want to empower people to write their own copy, so that they can express themselves at any given time and not have to hire a professional copywriter every single time they need to write something for their business. Do you think it's because women are scared? Yes. Well, I think there's a lot of layers to it, that I'm sure we could unpack with all the therapists. But yeah, I think women have been conditioned not to rock the boat. I think men have been conditioned to be appealing, we are taught to attract people to us, rather than to go after what we want. I have all kinds of I have all kinds of feminine feminist, the things to say.
But yes, I think as women we're afraid to figure out
what it is who it is, we really are. And what it is, we really have to share and own it. Because society has conditioned us to believe that we need to be appealing and soft and quiet and nurturing. And while there's absolutely a place for that, like this doesn't mean you have to go around everywhere in a power suit and ball bust. You know, like,
I love it. This just means that you know who you are, and you're not afraid to share that because that's what Foster's real connection, real authentic connection comes from knowing who you are, and being unafraid to share that. I love it. So we've got three actionable changes that you can make for your copy immediately. And like you said, it's going to improve connections, it's going to improve conversation. So what is the first thing that anybody listening ladies Listen up? to do? This episode is brought to you by the GST Academy. This step by step business productivity online program, we'll share with you exactly how to shift your mindset. set boundaries, build rock solid
processes, customize your message in order to strategically grow your revenues and get shit done. Visit Angela slash GSD Academy.
Before we get into the three C's, I just want to say that if you don't know what copywriting is, that's Oh, yeah, yeah, just gonna say the definition of copywriting. So all copywriting is, is writing that is designed to convince your reader to take a desired action. So that action could be anything from signing up for your email list to opting into a $10,000 coaching program. By the end of someone coming to your site, reading your email, reading your social posts, you want to make it really clear the action you want them to take. And that's all copywriting is, it's these little psychological magic tricks, like I said, that are peppered in through your writing that move the reader towards that action. So just just like a baseline understanding of what copywriting is, and also why it's super valuable, because you can write beautiful words on the page. But if you're not helping people understand what to do with them, then you're losing business. Right? So we're gonna go over my three C's of copywriting today, as Angela said, and the first one is clarity.
So you might have heard the statement in business, if you confuse them, you lose them. It's absolutely true. Yes, if you confuse people, then they're, they don't want to have to work hard to understand what you do. So that's why clarity comes first. Be clear over clever every single time. We're over clever, unless we're over clever. I also, I also love to tell people this because one of the most frequent questions I get is what do I name my business? Or what do I name, my course or my product? Be clear over clever, don't pick something that you're going to have to spell out every time somebody asks you what your business is, or your courses, pick something that immediately helps them understand, oh, this is what you do. Like my classes, copy class, like immediately, you know, oh, it's a class that teaches you copy? Yep. So but in terms of your website, copy, and your email, copy, not just names. Again, if no one understands what it is you're offering, then no one be nobody's gonna buy it. I'm so sorry.
It's true, it's true. And we only have, you know, a few seconds to capture somebody's attention and help them understand
how we can help them. And it's really important to know that 80% of readers, only skim headlines and sub headlines. So all that big, beautiful body copy that you're writing, as great as it is really focused on being super clear in your headlines, what it is you do. And a trick here, that is not only going to help with clarity for your reader, but also help boost your SEO is to put search keywords in those headers. What that does is again, with the psychological magic trick, it tell it's like a little Hansel and Gretel. Hansel and Gretel breadcrumb, like you're dropping these little keywords of things they're already searching for, into your copy or baking it in. And people see that and go, Oh, this is exactly what I need. Right? And it's super clear, because it's a commonly searched term or phrase.
So another trick I want to share with you for clarity, because
all right, y'all, everybody falls into one of two camps. You are either a deer in the headlights person who's like, I don't even know what to say. So I'm just not gonna say anything, or I'm not gonna launch my thing, or I'm just gonna put a few words up on a bland webpage and hide or you're a verbal vomiter which is me. You feel like you never explain yourself, you feel like you're never quite heard like you never quite get it right. You're one of those people who edits constantly. Verbal amateurs you're just bled all over the internet.
So, and that's 80% of us, by the way, most of us are Verbal vomiter is especially if you're a creative, especially if you're an overachiever, entrepreneur type. So here's what you do to get clarity.
Go ahead and verbal vomit, put it in a doc and just write it out. Don't judge yourself. Don't censor yourself. Don't edit it just lit onto the page. Then you're gonna print it out. You're gonna print it out on an actual like paper, and you're gonna take a highlighter, and just like you were in school with your textbook, when you were trying to
To find the most important information to study for a test, you're going to take that highlighter in your own copy. And you're only going to highlight the most important things you said, you're going to notice you repeated yourself a lot, you're going to notice that you have a lot of fluff in there that you don't need. Anything that you did not highlight, gets cut, just the highlighted bits. That's the clarity. That's what you put on the website. That's what you put in the sales email. That's what you put on your blog, whatever it is that you're having a hard time getting clarity with, highlight or trick works every time. So I typically hate paper. However, I do think for this exercise, it's very important, exactly what you're saying. Because there is some type of connection. And I do when we're teaching productivity and how to go paperless. I do have low ladies that are like, but when I write it down, I remember it better. And things stick out, which is fine. There's apps for that, like on the iPad, like when you write it down, and there's an app called good notes, where exactly what you're saying like you could go through and highlight it. In fact, when I used to run events, you know, would go through and like Mark things off and highlight things and it felt so good. But I think for this exercise that is very important to like, make that connection. It's almost like like, I think of it and you get this because you were in screenplays and acting. But it almost to me is like if you're watching a really good movie trailer. And it's like you edit out the best parts because you want to make someone want to see that movie. That's exactly right. That's how my by way cuz I love video. And so I process things like, okay, I just need to edit this down for like editing a trailer and like little snippets. And what I've learned also exactly what you're saying when you give away too much, and you word vomit, which was so me and some sometimes it still is, I've had a lot of speaking coaches help me complete assistance, and not to word vomit, because they're like, you're entertaining, but you lost me like 20 minutes ago. And so they're like, you're all over the place. Like you have a lot of great information, but oh my god, you need help. And so just self judgment, it's self judgment, it's us trying to feel like we are finally making our point. That's that's all verbal vomiting is is we're just we just keep talking because we just feel like, but but but I need you to understand, but but here we
are. Exactly, exactly. We all do it. My goodness, we all do it. And I think it's important to state also that writing and editing are two separate things. Like, don't be an editor while you write the editor is the jerk, like put the jerk in the other room. Just be the creative, like writer, person and let stuff flow and don't judge yourself. Then you can go away have a glass of wine come back, and you can invite the jerk editor and, you know, I love it hack everything to pieces. I love it. Cuz Some of us are wearing all those hats, like, let's be honest, like, right, sometimes you have to. So and even people that I know that used to have pretty large teams and content creator teams had to unfortunately let some of that go because of what happened in 2020. And then I know other people that grew with their teams, because they were doing something right clearly. Yeah. So that's a great exercise. It is. And I will say that having that distinction between the writing and the editing. That's why I encourage the highlighter trick. That's why I encourage not just editing it in your google doc or wherever you're edit because you won't highlight, you'll already try to edit yourself. Yep. And it's a completely different mental state to look at it on a page or on an app and just have the ability to highlight it. It's a totally different exercise. And I think I think that makes sense. 100% so everybody go get a piece of paper. And
so okay, clarity, I love that. And you're so right, because we've written a lot of courses, and I do a lot of courses and videos. And that is the consistent theme that I hear from from consultants and people that audit some of our stuff. They're like this is super cutesy, but nobody knows what the hell it is. And it can be both. It can absolutely be cutesy and informative. Yeah, so it's like I really do go back to exactly what you said starting out like be clear. Clever isn't always clear. And and it isn't. If I look back at some of our old titles, like I literally just laugh out loud because I'm like, nobody knows what the hell that it's like, No wonder it didn't sell
But then I was listening to an author speak one time. And he said, he, like wrote this great book, and no one helped him, he just did it. And then he self published it. And the information in there was great, but the title was terrible. And so then he hired someone to help him, like, get speaking gigs, because that's the whole reason he did the book. And then he said that the person changed the cover, and the color and the title. And it like took off, and so badly. And that's exactly, that's exactly the point exactly headlines. Because people need to immediately understand what it is that you're doing, I actually have a mini course on how to write a value proposition, which just means that you are immediately telling the reader or viewer, why you are different, what the value is that you are delivering in a super clear way. And people have a lot of resistance, because they feel like oh, I have to have this like cute tagline or I have to have like, a wink or whatever, that that's not the place for it. Like there are places for that in your about page. Where are there places for that on social media? Absolutely. There are places for it. But when you are thinking about what is someone's first impression, when they are landing on homepage of my website, or they are opening my email, I want them to immediately know the value that I'm giving them on this web page or on this email.
It matters, y'all it matters. So I'm sure a lot of you are like, Oh, I should go back and look at my website copy through a different lens. But it is helpful when you do it. And if you haven't done it in at least a year, like we go back and redo things, we update things, at least annually. Not I mean, really, if you're selling courses like quarterly, really, because I don't know about you, but like we get feedback from people, and I'm like, oh, that does make more sense. We should change that. Or like, you know, the data drops, like like you were saying, there's a few tools that we use to search keywords now. And so there's an app called keywords everywhere. It's a free Chrome extension that you can get, or you can do paid version. But there is a free version that can help you and tell you what people are searching for to come up with your titles. And so utilizing these resources, rather than just guessing is so much better, so much better. Okay, that's the second one going. Yes, I was gonna say it's a perfect segue for the second sees, we've got the three C's of copywriting. The first one was clarity. The second one is connection. And you know, we can talk all day till the cows come home about, you know, we have to foster connection in my writing, but you're like, Okay, Kelsey, how do I do that? Well, think about this. There is only one question in your readers mind at any given time. And it's borderline depressing. And it is, what's in it for me. And I know that sounds selfish, but it's true. Like when we land on a website, we're thinking, Okay, why am I here? What's in it for me? And when you start to think about your writing from that place of Oh, I need to explain to my reader, what's in it for her. Everything changes. And it makes it so much simpler, actually. Because you're no longer having to make yourself sound good. You're simply telling the person who's arriving, here's what I have to offer you. Here's what's in it for you. We've heard it a million times that it's not about us, it's about our ideal customer. Great copy invites the reader into the story versus telling them a story. If that makes sense. When you invite somebody into the story, what that means is they can see themselves in the copy, they can see how their life is going to get better. They can see how things are going to get easier when they implement whatever the services you're offering. Versus telling them hey, I'm great, you should pay me for this thing.
It's so true. It is so good. Like, I don't mean to interrupt you, but not at all like oh my god, like last night, I was reading a mock up email that someone did one of our clients. And, you know, I never want to like make someone feel like Oh, your stuff sucks. Like, I never want anyone to feel like that. But no one's ever taught them how to actually write an email to get to an action. And so I literally counted in this mock email how many times it said I, we, me, and I'm like, consider replacing just about all of those. It was over 35 times. And I'm like and this was like a three little paragraph email. I'm like, consider replacing that with you.
You're like, what are your needs? Like, I don't care who you are and what you're doing and how great you are, like, how can you help me? And someone taught me that a long time ago. And it's not that we genuinely don't want to make it about our client. Because Come on, let's be honest, most women, we get happiness from caring and taking care of other people. A lot of women are like that. And so it's just we've never been taught before. So that's really, really, really important. What is it absolutely is and I so like Angela said, I love actionable tips, like I love take something away, put it in your copy immediately and watch the magic happen. One of the best ways if you're stuck on like, okay, but how do I do that? How do I tell my reader what's in it for me, here's, here's exactly what you do.
You are going to mine reviews. When I say mine, I mean, like, seven dwarves with a pickaxe getting golden nuggets, you are mining for those reviews, you are going to go to both reviews of your product or service, and the reviews of your competitors, like people who are offering something that is similar to you, or has similar vibe to you, you're going to read the reviews. And what's going to happen is you're going to start to see key words and phrases or points being made over and over both positive and negative, you are going to literally copy and paste those key words and phrases, and you're going to put them in your own copy. And what that does, is it makes the reader feel like oh my god, she's in my head. It's like she took the words right out of my mouth. Because guess what you did you lay the words out of your customers mouth. So it's an easy way to sort of jumpstart that thinking, look at what people are saying, Look at their pain points, bake them in, anticipate those frequently asked questions in your copy, and have that what's in it for me, Oh, my God, this is exactly what I wanted. This is exactly what I was looking for, then you know, you're on the right path, and you're gonna start to see a lot more conversions. And ladies, if you're thinking, Oh, I don't ask people for reviews, or I don't ask people for their feedback, you have to ask that you have such a good point. I'm so glad you brought this up. People want to give you reviews, please understand this. They gave you their money, they're happy that you gave them a service. They want to give feedback. The best thing I ever did in my course, was I baked in a place for people to give a review in the course itself. And I have a much better understanding of my customers, not just the positive like, Oh, yeah, I feel warm and fuzzy about this, I get a lot of that, which is great. But the really valuable stuff too is like, you know, I wish that this was explained a little bit differently, or I wish there was more about this subject or you know, I didn't really need that lesson. That's gonna help you grow so much faster. So don't worry about feeling annoying, asking for reviews. People love giving their opinions look at Yelp. Look at all the people on Yelp.
Right. And I will say like, sometimes it might come across as critical, but I don't think people are being critical. Like they're genuinely just trying to tell you their honest opinion. And if you take a deeper dive and not a defensive dive, yeah, it can change so much like for, for me, this is our third year that we really really do go through and redo GST Academy every year about productivity gets shit done. And so I used to do these long videos. And I was told by multiple people last year that they tried to go back and and re remember something that I had said like about Dropbox, for example, but they couldn't remember where it was in the video. And it was so annoying. Literally a Google said it was so annoying to go back and to have to scroll to find where you started talking about Dropbox. And so by taking that feedback, I'm like, Okay, well when we redo it, and then we also have a consultant, you know, that helps and goes through it to make it better every year. She said the exact same thing. She's like, no longer than 15
she's like, we're gonna break these up in chunks because people she's like, I know you can sit and talk about this stuff for an hour and a half straight. But when people are consuming information, that's not normal.
It's just like, clarity to it goes right like me.
get super clear and make it easy to digest. Yes, talking to a third grader like it, it all goes back to that, like, all of these things are important on their own. But they're even more powerful when they're together. If you can marry copy, if you can marry clarity and connection, like your what you're just describing, like if you're hearing that feedback, and you are both getting clearer about what you're offering and getting clear about your messaging at the same time, that's gold. Yep. It was just it was so. And again, it's it's crazy, because probably like, and I asked for video reviews, and then we take them we use, which usually is pretty good. It's inexpensive. It transcribes everything. And so a lot of these women, there'll be like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I'm like, why are you sorry? No, I'm saying you're sorry. Like, I don't you don't need to be sorry. Because you're telling me how this can better help you like, right? Quit apologizing. I don't want the feedback. If I didn't want it, I wouldn't ask. Right. So just ask if you ask your audience and pull your audience and just ask, it's crazy to ask, and you can make it really easy on them. And here's the thing, if people don't want to give you a review, then they just will ignore that. And that's okay. That's totally their prerogative. And it has nothing to do with you is notice not personal, make it super easy for them to just hit reply on an email and send you something after they've taken your course or after they've, you know, had, you know, however many life coaching sessions or whatever it is just a really quick, simple script is I would love to know your favorite things about working with me. And I would love to know where you had any roadblocks or where you think things could be improved. That's it super simple, super easy. And then people can reply if they want. And that's great. And it's a win win. It's a win win for both they feel heard you get a nice testimonial. I love it. Do you have any thoughts on asking someone to do a video testimonial versus doing an actual like, just type it out and send it to me. So here's my thought on that. In general, I say video testimonials are amazing. But it is a bigger ask. So if you are just starting out, I would say make it as easy as possible for somebody to leave you a review in the format that they are most comfortable with. For me, I have found that people are very open to and quick to just write a quick note if it's baked into something that I'm offering them.
Just making it as easy as possible on that person. But if you can get video reviews, for example, if somebody just is like over the moon about your service, by all means be like it would mean so much to me, if you wouldn't mind just on your phone recording a quick review of your time here, whatever it is, and sending it to me, you don't have to edit it like don't worry about looking good, whatever it is like I would love to have I would love to hear that from you. It's just a bigger ask is that is the point. And one strategy that we use with one company, a psychology company was we had an interviewer who blocks like 15 minutes, and there was a link so people could go in after they were done going through it and click the link. And then it would schedule like a 15 minute Interviewer And then we would just edit out the person that was asking the questions. Yeah, took a little bit of guidance, like the interviewer would say, repeat the question, and then let me know your thoughts. And so that way it was when we edited everything out like the interviewer It was a more natural, like back and forth thing. But it also seemed to capture more like real emotion. where some people that don't like video, like crap. Let me start this again. Don't overthink it, just be yourself. Like it's no big deal. Like be Yeah, and if you as the business owner worried about having that big ask I would say by all means be open to offering them a bonus or like yeah, I have a friend who has the same deal where she's like if you send a video review, to show my gratitude I would love to gift you this extra product that's you know, one of her her lower priced things but it's still high value. And so at you know is like a token of appreciation, but it doesn't necessarily influence their review either. Like it's it's a great tool just if if you're trying to find reviews, and again all of this is just to bake into your copy but reviews are always great testimonials are the best way to prove
You're your to do social proof, which means it's proof that somebody has paid you for this thing. Rather than you just saying, I promise. I'm great. Have somebody else say, hey, Kelsey is great. Yeah. I love how you say bake it, because it's like little ingredients. And chocolate chips. Yeah. And everything's good. And then it all tastes good. And it smells good. And it's amazing. you rather have chocolate chips and plain Oh, come on. I love it. I love how you say that. It's awesome. Like memorable. Good. Well, that brings me to the last point on connection, which I think is really important to address before we move on, which is to write how you talk. Please, please, please do not feel like you have to write like a buttoned up LinkedIn profile. And my website is my resume. And I am a robot human and I never use contractions.
Please, I beg you, this is your permission slip. Write how you talk, it goes both ways to like, if you're not a sassy person who puts an N apostrophe at the end of stuff. Don't write like that either. Like, just be yourself, write how you talk, don't worry so much about grammar or like being, quote unquote, professional. People want to connect with human beings, not faceless companies. And one of the best ways to do that is to just be more relaxed with your writing style. And if you're having trouble with this, this is great for those deer in the headlights, folks.
Take out your phone, you've got a voice memo recorder. And pretend like you're explaining your service or your product to your best friend, hit playback. And literally write out the words that you just spoken to your voice memo. It's one of the easiest ways if you're feeling hung up on writing, quote, unquote, speak it talk out loud, and then transcribe that. That's one of the best ways to make sure that you actually sound like yourself.
Yeah, and sometimes, though, like,
somebody that I worked with said, just have a conversation with me. And then you know, I'm like, just talking like a talk. And she's like, you say, fuck way too much.
She's like, No, I know that you grew up around, men cussing, but she's like, you got to dial it back just a little bit. I'm like, Oh, shit, okay.
Like, oh, so I don't want to offend anybody. But, you know, it's like, dropping an F bomb once in a while, you know, if that's
you are.
your ideal customer is going to be like, Oh, thank God, I don't have to like, be I don't have to worry about swearing around this chick. And those people are going to gravitate towards you. And you're going to get more connections and more connections lead to our third C, can we move? Can we get to arthur c? Yes, what's over there. All right, third, C is conversions. So remember how at the very beginning of this talk, I said that copywriting is the art and science of using words to take a reader towards a desired action. So that action is your conversion. If your reader takes the action, they convert from being a reader to being a customer. So in order to have those conversions, you need to know what the action is you want them to take in the first place, right? So I always tell people that every page should have a copy goal. What is the goal action you want the reader to take? Again, it could be as simple as opting into a freebie or it could be write me a review, or it could be contact me via this form, sign up for my newsletter, buy my $10,000 program, whatever it is, make sure you know what the goal is, so that you can calculate how many people are actually converting. That's going to be really, really helpful as Angela was talking about, you know, if you're doing an edit, if you're doing an audit and edit of your website, you won't know if it's effective if you don't understand if that page is converting. So that means figuring out how many times somebody clicks that opt in button. That means how many times is somebody hitting send on contact me. Those are how those are the ways the only ways you can understand how effective a website is. Same goes for email, have a goal. At the end of your email is the goal to get them to follow you on social media is the goal to get them to forward this email to somebody so you can grow your list, whatever it is, have the goal and make the calls to action clear and frequent. Don't be afraid of overdoing it with the calls to action.
The last thing I'm going to say about conversions is I highly, highly, highly, highly, highly recommend that on your website, the main action you drive to is getting people to sign up for your email list.
Here's why. nerdy statistics time push the imaginary glasses up the nose, this is the best part.
A message is six times more likely to be seen in an inbox than it is on social media. And the reason that that statistic is important is because studies have shown over and over and over again, that we need to be exposed to something at a minimum seven times before we say yes, it is so much easier to show up in someone's inbox seven times and have them open seven emails than it is to organically magically drive them to a website seven times. So what that means is you capture that person one time on your website, you can show up in their inbox forever, and provide value to them over and over. That's what gets them to trust you. And that's what gets them to say, Okay, you know what, I trust you enough to now invest in you. That's why you need to make sure that your opt ins are related to your paid offers. That's why you need your website to be driving people to your email list because sales happen in the inbox. They happen in the inbox not on your website. you own your audience. Yes. And I learned this the hard way, y'all I'm doing hallelujah hands on the air and their shimron like perfect story to relate to reviews. So there was Facebook used to have this plugin. This was years ago. But for me, I was in the middle of pivoting from just being and not saying like, Oh, I'm just a wedding and event planner. But there was a bigger purpose for me when Nashville flooded in 2010. And how it was really important that I started to teach people how to be productive and put their stuff in the cloud. And so I was I started speaking and i a lot of it, I was doing it all for free, because I love to do it. But I was also building another business. So the reviews at work the most important thing to me. So we had put a widget through Facebook onto my blog, there were hundreds of people that had gone on. And this was like when lead pages and opt ins, it's like, I'll give you my slides if you give me your email. But when you give me your email, give me your feedback, like what did you learn? So and you would click the little widget and we go to post it to Facebook and then post our blog. Well, one day, I was looking on our blog for something else. And there was like, you know, the red X's when something's wrong? Yeah. Oh, no. Oh, no. It's like the TIC tock, just skier Oh, no. And so I email my web guy who's still my web guy. And I'm like, lose my shit.
I didn't hear from him for a few days. And then he email and he's like, Can we schedule a time to talk and we never talk? Okay, we text or we email when now we Marco Polo. And Marco Polo didn't exist back then. And he's like, I don't know how to tell you this. But Facebook did away with the widget. And we didn't back it up on the server. And did you screenshot it and put it anywhere on your blog or anything, I lost every review, because Facebook decided to just get rid of the plugin or the widget. So I became, I mean, I cry. And I'm not a big crier. But like, on course I would cry and cry for weeks. Yeah, I was sick. But again, I'm kind of glad it happened in the beginning of that new business because now I'm psycho like if someone leaves like a Google review, or you know, wherever I'm, like, screenshot that shit and put it on our blog. We own the content. we own our audience. So that's why email list and also, when you put so much content out on social media, start with your blog first. And I know a lot of people like blogs are outdated and no one looks at blogs. I'm like, Yes, that is tik tok goes away well for SEO too. And I remember, even recently, people are like, oh, tic tocs going away the Chinese government runner. And I'm like, what about all that content, whatever. I'm like, well, all my content is also on YouTube. And now it's on reels. So make sure that you understand that if you don't own your audience, and if Instagram or something went away or worse, to get hacked, yep, we literally at the same time, we're like you get hacked. That's I know, I know, way too many people like you think it's not gonna happen to you. It's like an earthquake in California or a flooding set like it. You think it's not going to happen to you until it happens. Right and then you've lost everyone and everything. You cannot really you cannot build
House on borrowed land, like, your email list is the most important thing, even if you don't have anything to sell yet. I think that's a really important point. A lot of people think, Well, I'm not going to start a list until I have something to sell. No, no, no. Start your list. Like, that's the first thing you should do. So many big time entrepreneurs say that their biggest regret was not starting their email list sooner me included, because I thought oh, well, I don't have a course yet. So I'm not gonna really like need a big list. No, no, no, you The day will come when you need that big list. And here's the other another Nerdy statistic. For every $1 you invest in email marketing, you get an estimated $45 back. That isn't insane. That's crazy return on investment. That's awesome. Yeah, yeah. So drive to the inbox y'all everywhere you can on social on.
on your website, like even your swipe up links on social, make them go to a landing page where you get to capture email addresses, bake it into your blogs, as Angela was talking about a blog people do read blogs, your pins, your pins on Pinterest, make sure that whenever somebody is taking an action, there is an opportunity for them to sign up for your email list. If they're not already on it. Yep. So this has been so helpful. So the three C's for copy you guys clarity, connection, conversion. So as we wrap up, I know that you only teach this a few times a year, and you have a new course launching it like really soon, which is really I know the turnaround is really amazing. The timing of this is really, really special. Totally meant to be Yes, more. Thank you for that segue. I love it. So you guys, my main Signature Course my baby is called copy class. It's been around for a year, I have 6000 students who are so wonderful, who have such amazing things to say. And the goal of copy class is not to teach you to become a professional copywriter. We don't go into all the technical jargon and all that nonsense. What I do how I teach is I give real life examples and actionable tips for you to take away and immediately start to implement it in your copy. So you can immediately start to see results. So what copy class is, is it's a copywriting course for non writers. It teaches you in Module One of the fundamentals of copywriting like your basic toolkit, you're going to come back to again and again and again. It's going to teach you how to build your ideal customer Avatar and a unique brand voice based on her again, coming back to that what's in it for me baking in your your customers pain points into your copy, module three, and this is this is the most insane value. Module Three is an entire step by step process of how to write a high converting website. To put that in perspective, it costs around five to 10 grand for a professional copywriter to do that for you. So keep that in mind.
module four is my personal favorite, which is all about emails, I give you a template for a welcome sequence that has been proven to convert over and over and over again, it's my favorite thing about the course. I give you subject lines that will increase your open rates. I help you understand what to say and when to send it. All of this is inside copy class and Angela will have a link for you. But I'm happy to answer any questions also. And copy classes only open twice a year. And you're super lucky because it's open right now. It reopened January 18 for just a couple of weeks. So definitely head on over to that page. ask me any questions you might have. I would love Love, love to tell you all about it. Yay. So if you guys go to Angela Proffitt comm slash copy class, you will be able to get access to all the amazing things that you just talked about. And it's funny that you just said that about copywriters because we literally just redid our entire website. And it was that investment and more. Yeah, because the thing it's it's one of those things that like, people ask me all the time, well, shouldn't I just hire a professional? And the answer sometimes is yes. If you're at a certain level and you're ready to do that, by all means copywriting is one of the most valuable investments you can make. Yeah, however,
you should be able to write your own copy 80% of the time. It is
is not cost effective, time effective, or I like to say sole effective for you to have to hire out every time you want to write something for your business, it's just not practical. And it also leaves you feeling unheard. At the end of the day, you have to have a brand voice for somebody else to use, even if you're hiring a professional. So it's one of the most valuable skills you can learn. Because Another thing is you have it for life. Like, it's not based on some algorithm that's going to change in a year. It's not based on a platform that's going to go away. Like Angela said, the plugins not gonna go away. copywriting is based on human psychology. It's based on how people make decisions. And if you can understand how to help people make a decision to work with you, you are going to be exponentially more successful no matter what business you're in
this, like, I'm super excited, I'm going to go through it. And then I have so many people too, that I need to make sure that they listen to this podcast, because a lot of the questions that we get aren't really specifically about copy, but it is about copy. They just don't know it. So what you just said about, like, we call it an indoctrination campaign. So when someone comes on to the email list, how do you greet them? And how do you nurture them? And you know, that's one of the reasons that I love doing the podcast. And I love having people like yourself, who are experts at these things. But what I've also learned and the feedback that I've gotten is like, you don't really have to be an expert at everything or anything, people just want help. That's all they want. They want help. And so I feel like this help can give people exactly what you said. And it actually like talking through it, it gives me a little bit more confidence in myself good. Like, wait, like, I might think that there are so many things in business that feel like these big scary skills that people sort of fear based marketing us into feeling like oh, I need this or I'm a bad entrepreneur, right? That is not what this is about. What this is about is helping you understand places where you can improve your confidence so that you know exactly how to tell people how you can help them. That's all the basis of copywriting is and it is. So please like help me let me demystify writing for you. It is not some scary skill you have to get a degree in. There are so many tricks like the ones you learned today in this podcast that are going to be real life, things that you can use over and over and over again and teach your team how to use over and over and over again, if you've got a team, it's a I'm such an evangelist about copywriting because it literally helps everyone like anywhere you have words that represent you or your business and that includes your video. That's copy. So if you understand how to uplevel that.
Oh my gosh, like what a light bulb? Yep. This was so helpful. So if people want to connect with you on social because that's where I met you we connected on Instagram. Where are you hanging out these days? best place to find me is Instagram and I'm at Kelsey dot writes WRI t s and DM me and tell me that you've heard this podcast. I'd love to chat with you about it. Love it. And woo in the show notes. I know some of you are jiving when you're listening. We'll put all of this in the show notes. So you can go back you can refer to how you can connect with Kelsey on social. And then check out her copy class Angela Proffitt comm slash copy class. And if you enroll, I would love to know like, what are your top takeaways from it? Because I'm going to go through it too. And I know that I'm going to learn something because I learned these three things today. And then like you said, just my big takeaway is like, don't be afraid to write like you talk. Like, that's my biggest thing is because I say I'm not a writer. And I'm not a good reader. But I know I mean, I'll talk a lot I do a lot of videos. So keeping that mindset, like as I'm writing if I sit down to write, and quit worrying about people telling me like, Oh, don't worry, you need a comma there. You need a period there. I'm like, Listen, I don't talk perfect. So my writing is not going to be perfect. But I have for you guys to share with us and let us know what your top takeaway was from today. Kelsey, thank you so much for your time. This was incredible. I'm so happy. Thank you so much for having me. Awesome. And everybody that's listening. Go check out copy class. And thank you so much for your time today. Be sure to tune in next week for another episode of business unveiled. Bye. That's it for this week's episode of business unveiled.
Now that you have all the tools that you need to conquer the world and GSD get shit done. Would you share this with your friends and fellow business leaders? One thing that would really, really help us and help new listeners is for you to rate the show, and leave a comment and Apple podcast, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you tune in and listen to business unveiled. You can check out the show notes at Angela slash podcast and link up with us on social media so you can share your biggest insights. And I want to know your aha moments. Until next week, remember, the profitable shifts and structures you're creating in your business, help you be more present in your life. So get out there and GSD


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